48 replies to this topic

[jxeboy]

In the newest episode of This Week in Sim Racing, they announced that the Lotus 49 will be coming to iRacing. Now's our chance to directly compare the evolution of physics. I for one am extremely excited. I know iRacing isn't talked about with lots of love here, but I have enjoyed it the past few years, and now one of my favorite styles of cars is coming to the sim.

[Art-J]

Coincidence, or are they starting to feel C.A.R.S. project breath on their back? Whatever that is, it's cool to see all the key players in the recent sim business paying some attention to '60s machinery again.

[Rudy Dingemans]

Well, whether it's because of RF2 and CARS or not, it's good to see Papyr... sorry iRacing getting back to its roots and doing some proper historic cars. Kaemmer re-doing the car that (partly) made him famous, and with the modern technology sounds definitely like droolware to me. Enough to make any GPL fan drool a bit, I guess..!  

Too bad it's online/subscription-only (so like most simracers worldwide, I won't be running it).

Regards, Rudy
(GPLRank: -40)

Edited by Rudy Dingemans, Nov 05 2011 - 03:51 PM.

[Pete Gaimari]

I started a thread on iRacing begging for a Lotus 49. Some loved the idea, and some hated it. The staff wouldn't even come the thread. I left iRacing. Now I may have to go back for my favorite car. Even if I just practice with it.

[Wile E. Coyote]

Art-J, on Nov 05 2011 - 03:12 PM, said:

Coincidence, or are they starting to feel C.A.R.S. project breath on their back? Whatever that is, it's cool to see all the key players in the recent sim business paying some attention to '60s machinery again.

Yeah, and rFactor too, and now even iRacing. It seems like all the big developers are scheming together and are determined to kill off GPL once and for all.
Still it isn't enough to make me go back to  $Racing again and that they chose Lotus makes me even more so, they should have chosen the Brabham instead.
Nah just kidding, the real reason why games like iRacing, rFactor and future  C.A.R.S. and Simraceway aren't my cup of tea is because they are online multiplay and I play rather offline against AI.

[brr]

Wile E. Coyote, on Nov 06 2011 - 05:52 AM, said:

It seems like all the big developers are scheming together and are determined to kill off GPL once and for all.

Its unlikely that the big developers are even aware that GPL is still barely alive.

[jxeboy]

brr, on Nov 06 2011 - 06:21 AM, said:

Wile E. Coyote, on Nov 06 2011 - 05:52 AM, said:

It seems like all the big developers are scheming together and are determined to kill off GPL once and for all.

Its unlikely that the big developers are even aware that GPL is still barely alive.

I think you would be surprised. GPL is respected amongst the entire sim racing community. At least a couple times a month someone new pops up on the iRacing forums asking how they can reinstall GPL. Of course I point them here

[Pete Gaimari]

brr, on Nov 06 2011 - 06:21 AM, said:

Wile E. Coyote, on Nov 06 2011 - 05:52 AM, said:

It seems like all the big developers are scheming together and are determined to kill off GPL once and for all.

Its unlikely that the big developers are even aware that GPL is still barely alive.

I think it's more like they'd wish it would die. They hate losing money to a 13 year old sim.

[John Woods]

You guys are a hoot. Grand Prix Legends is not fading away.

The race sim market fractured, which is a natural occurence with growth and expansion.
I don't think the current for-profit developers are loosing any money to GPL.

Its probably the other way around, as Grand Prix Legends brings people into the PC sport and while some start with GPL then go on, thinking they are moving up...as noted some come back or go on with all of them.

iRacing boasts 30,000 users (are they all active?) racing on less than 50 tracks, and they are a very different demographic than (just guessing) the average Grand Prix Legends user.

Direct response analysts confirm those who do things like call in to talk shows, respond to mailings, post on forums, etc. represents a very small fraction of total viewers/doers/users, generally less than 1.5 percent. Earlier today it might have been noted there were over 100 members and guests on the SRMZ forums, suggesting there is a substantial multiple of that number still enjoying Grand Prix Legends, (and as I keep reminding, there are over 15K downloads of the GtMod).

Likely what developers really might be concerned about, if at all, is the ongoing improvements to GPL that keeps it viable, and once kept GPL way ahead of single firm developers. When all is added up among racesims, Grand Prix Legends still blows the rest away. That's what I'd guess, if anything, they don't like. Its too difficult and overwhelming to compete with 13-years of enhancements and a Credits List none of them could afford to hire.

And hiding there in the mists and shadows of GPL's future is the potential to keep it the greatest race sim ever, (hint, hint).

[Rudy Dingemans]

John Woods, on Nov 06 2011 - 11:47 AM, said:

You guys are a hoot. Grand Prix Legends is not fading away.

Totally true, since it's already faded. Or rather, it's had its biggest fading phase behind it already. Now it's still alive, but within a very small community that's still left. This is not 2001, it's 2011, ten years on.
The heady days of RSC and dozens of daily new threads on all things GPL are long gone. We were there, and we loved it. Now, we still love the sim for what it is, and appreciate how good it still is despite its age. (But hardly think it's the current gold standard or the way of the future.)

brr, on Nov 06 2011 - 06:21 AM, said:

Its unlikely that the big developers are even aware that GPL is still barely alive.

Yup.

They'll all know about it, they know it was the legendary sim that started it all, but that's about it. In terms of financial interest or development, GPL was out of the game ages ago already. No surprise there, with its code base from back in 1998.  

But as I once said, it sparked a genre, the genre of historic simracing, just like Frankenheimer's 'Grand Prix' sparked GPL at one point in time. In iRacing or rF2 or CARS, we can now see its heritage being reignited with all that historic content being introduced. And that's a good thing. That's where you can see that GPL, even though it wasn't a big commercial succes, is hardly forgotten.

Just don't make GPL at this time more than it is, which is a special interest sim based on very old code, supported by a loyal but small user group. It's still remarkably good in lots of ways, but it's not the sim of all sims any more. It's from 1998, after all. Considering its age, it's still doing remarkably well, albeit on a small scale.
But the real question is: will any of these new sims live up to its hype and at one point be considered The Real Successor of GPL?  It's a tall task, given how good GPL was (is).

Regards, Rudy
(GPLRank: -40)

Edited by Rudy Dingemans, Nov 06 2011 - 04:15 PM.

[Pete Gaimari]

I'll have to remind you John. I've downloaded the mods at least 10 times for different reasons. That might be a high number compared to most, but i'm sure a lot of racers have downloaded more than once. So, don't be swayed by the numbers too much.

It's like looking at the views of a thread, and saying that many people viewed it. I might view a long thread 25-30 times at a minimum.

[rfratelli]

I agree that iracing is expensive, but you pay for quality here. You got laser-scan tracks, cars built with real data from manufactures (they managed to get access to a real lotus 49 to model it in the sim), and all this comes with a price. I´m not arguing if iracing´s physics are better than other sims out there, but they put a lot of effort in the sim and it think it´s fair to pay for it.

I´ve had thousands of fun with GPL and i still do. I do have an iracing subscription and i´m enjoying a lot as well. And very excited with this lotus 49 announcement.

[Pete Gaimari]

I've wasted hundreds of dollars on iRacing. I still have more fun driving GPL, and it cost me $20 so far.

[Bruce]

Wile E. Coyote, on Nov 06 2011 - 05:52 AM, said:

...... and are determined to kill off GPL once and for all.....

Huh?
How can something that's been out of production for nearly 12 years be "killed off"?
Technically, it's already dead, just as are ICR2 and the various NASCAR Racing sims from Papyrus, yet they all have as loyal a following as GPL.

And besides - do you really expect that everyone who enjoys GPL will just dump it overnight and head off to iRacing?

I doubt it.

[Bruce]

Rudy Dingemans, on Nov 06 2011 - 04:05 PM, said:

......they know it was the legendary sim that started it all, ....

Wrong.
"Indianapolis 500" is what started the ball rolling.
That product generated the income needed for Papyrus to go on with their show.
Thank God for that first Papyrus sim, that's all I can say.

BK