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Montjuich Setup


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#1 ronibios

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Posted May 16 2022 - 06:11 PM

Hi guys, i've been struggling a lot to get a competitive time at Montjuich, mainly due to the setup, does anyone has a setup for this track?

Edited by ronibios, May 16 2022 - 07:26 PM.


#2 Blethym 1

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Posted May 17 2022 - 12:07 AM

The Ferdi site has setups and replays for Montjuic. Is this the same as Montjuich? If yes, it should have what you are looking for. See link :

GPL-Setup (ferdinandschulze.de)

#3 Saiph

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Posted May 17 2022 - 05:36 AM

View PostBlethym 1, on May 17 2022 - 12:07 AM, said:

The Ferdi site has setups and replays for Montjuic. Is this the same as Montjuich? If yes, it should have what you are looking for. See link :

GPL-Setup (ferdinandschulze.de)

Blethym, although ronibios hasn't bothered to tell us which mod he's using or even which car(s) he's driving, he has posted his question in the 'GPL-69 mod' section. And there don't appear to be any 1969 mod setups on that website. :idunno:

ronibios, it would help if you could give us a little information. Firstly, are you using the original 1969 mod? Or are you using the later 1969-Extra mod? And which car or cars are you driving? If you give us some little clues like this, maybe we can direct you to some helpful files (or maybe even post some here). :pathead: ;) :)

#4 lalb2001

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Posted May 17 2022 - 08:12 AM

There are some 69 setups (though I don't know whether 69 or 69X) on CustomRank, also one for montjc69 for the McLaren M7A. Perhaps you could transfer that setup over to another car by changing the file extension, perhaps with help of this list. :)

#5 jgf

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Posted May 17 2022 - 08:53 AM

I always recommend learning at least the basics of setups so you can create your own, then you are set for any car at any track.  Setups are individual, adapting the car's handling to the driver's style, by using someone else setup you are adapting your style to their car;  much like wearing someone else shoes, it may work but is rarely a good fit.  Not to say you cannot learn from other setups, when having a problem at a particular track I may look at several other setups for that car at that track, seeking patterns - is everyone using a softer setup than mine, or maybe all using more camber ...anything that will give me a lead on what is wrong with my setup.

This is true even in real life.  Modern F1 and "Indycar" teams often comment on how different are the setups for their two drivers;  Schumacher was known for preferring very stiff, "twitchy" setups which his teammates found undriveable, while he described his teammate's setups as sluggish.  As an aside, this is a major difference with endurance racing, where there may be 2, 3, or 4 drivers alternating in one car;  obviously they can't change the setup with each driver change so a compromise is found and the drivers' adapt.

In looking at others' setups you may get lucky and find someone whose style is so similar to yours that you can comfortably use their setups, perhaps with slight tweaks (usually steering), but this is rare.  In the early days of N2k3 I found a collection of setups by "Dray" that, with a change of steering ratio and dropping the rear bar one click, I am still using. (I haven't come to terms with asymmetric caster and the track bar.)

#6 ronibios

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Posted May 17 2022 - 11:54 AM

Thanks for the answers guys, currently im using the Brabham BT26 on the 69-XTRA mod, is there a post talking about setups here? I only know the basics about it.

Edited by ronibios, May 17 2022 - 12:23 PM.


#7 gliebzeit

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Posted May 17 2022 - 01:42 PM

Montjuïc is sometimes spelled Montjuich

#8 lalb2001

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Posted May 17 2022 - 04:00 PM

Apart from steering ratio and brake bias which are (also) subjective, the ramp angles do a lot for a beginner. First number is for power, second is for coast. When applying throttle, torque is transferred to the rear wheels, when off-throttle, the rears apply the torque back to the engine. This is why the two numbers work the opposite way. For power, 85 is the most conservative setting and 30 is the most aggressive one, for coast the exact opposite is the case. Without clutches, 85/30 is the most conservative and 30/85 the most aggressive setting you can get. Which combination of numbers you want to use depends on how you like the handling.
Clutches basically multiply the effect of the ramp angles. If you load up GPL Setup Manager, you will see a locking percentage number next to the ramp angles. That number shwos you the exact differential setting (ramp angles combined with clutches) Higher locking percentage on power will make the car more nervous when using the throttle, and lower locking percentage on coast will do the same when lifting (completely!).
Here we have another aspect to consider. In GPL, there is a simple switch in the differential. Lifting fully will have you receive the coast ramp angle, but whenever you just apply 1% of throttle, you fully get the effect of the power ramp angle.

As for the rest, Lee has published some articles over here that you may want to read (bottom of the page). :) Generally, feel free to ask about (particular) setup aspects on this forum and I am sure there are people who can explain it to you. :)

Edited by lalb2001, May 17 2022 - 04:04 PM.


#9 entdgc

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Posted May 18 2022 - 01:07 AM

View Postlalb2001, on May 17 2022 - 04:00 PM, said:

Here we have another aspect to consider. In GPL, there is a simple switch in the differential. Lifting fully will have you receive the coast ramp angle, but whenever you just apply 1% of throttle, you fully get the effect of the power ramp angle.

Lasse,
Far be it from me, a relative newbie, to question this but I wonder whether 'fully off throttle' for coast is correct? If going around a fast curve throttle on and I feel I am running wide I only have to come off the throttle a little to get a kick of oversteer and the rear steps out killing the understeer. So I had come to the conclusion that power applies when engine is powering wheels and coast applies when wheels are driving engine as you said earlier.

i would be interested in a definitive answer to this from the collective...
Dave

#10 lalb2001

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Posted May 18 2022 - 04:22 AM

View Postentdgc, on May 18 2022 - 01:07 AM, said:

Lasse,
Far be it from me, a relative newbie, to question this but I wonder whether 'fully off throttle' for coast is correct? If going around a fast curve throttle on and I feel I am running wide I only have to come off the throttle a little to get a kick of oversteer and the rear steps out killing the understeer. So I had come to the conclusion that power applies when engine is powering wheels and coast applies when wheels are driving engine as you said earlier.

i would be interested in a definitive answer to this from the collective...
Dave

Technically this is correct. A quick throttle lift however will often do enough to avoid understeer because of the change in slip angle and weight transfer direction of the car. With 30/85/1 which is what I drive very often, I notice this on/off pattern. As Robert Fleurke is quoted in that article:

Quote

Robert Fluerke in an SRMZ post stated that some left foot braking aliens use extremely high coast ramp angles of 60 to 85 degrees, but normally keep a little bit of throttle applied with the right foot so that the power ramp angle is used during corner entry. However if they miss the racing line, carry too much speed, or have understeer during corner entry, they completely lift off the throttle to get extra rotation from the coast ramp angle...pretty clever.

And it works pretty well from my experience. :)

I just read what you meant: There is little difference in feeling between 85 and 30 power when using low throttle of course. It's just that GPL differential being a switch is technically correct because the GPL code works that way.

Edited by lalb2001, May 18 2022 - 04:32 AM.


#11 paul skingley

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Posted May 18 2022 - 09:48 AM

Brabham BT26 is a nice car but can be a bit twitchy.

Try the Ferrari. It is a bit slower but has a more forgiving chassis.

The 1969 cars make their lap time in the corners, so unless the track has very long straights I would suggest using maximum rear wing and 12 or 13 front wing.

Here is my Ferrari setup if you want to give it a go.

Attached Files



#12 jgf

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Posted May 18 2022 - 10:44 AM

View Postlalb2001, on May 18 2022 - 04:22 AM, said:

Technically this is correct. A quick throttle lift however will often do enough to avoid understeer because of the change in slip angle and weight transfer direction of the car. With 30/85/1 which is what I drive very often, I notice this on/off pattern. As Robert Fleurke is quoted in that article:



And it works pretty well from my experience. :)

I just read what you meant: There is little difference in feeling between 85 and 30 power when using low throttle of course. It's just that GPL differential being a switch is technically correct because the GPL code works that way.

This underscores my opinion that setups are quite individual, tailoring the handling of the car to your driving style.  Being a leadfoot, if I use power settings that low I just cut donuts all over the track, I need at least a 60 setting to control wheelspin;  others trying my setups complain of understeer.  But that is why there are adjustments, there is no "right" setup, only what works for you.

Many years ago i played golf;  I was told I didn't stand properly, didn't hold the club properly, didn't swing properly ...but my scores were as good, or bad, as anyone else.

BTW, does not the number of clutches control how quickly the switch from power to coast or vice versa?

#13 Cookie

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Posted May 18 2022 - 04:42 PM

View Postjgf, on May 18 2022 - 10:44 AM, said:

BTW, does not the number of clutches control how quickly the switch from power to coast or vice versa?

It is a multiplier of the locking effect of the differential
- Lee has posted a picture of the blocking percentages of the combinations of the clutches and ramp angels.

http://gplmotorworks...ntial-Info.html




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