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About Tire Pressure Bug Fix Patch


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#16 JMF

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Posted Jan 14 2017 - 08:59 AM

I made minor camber adjustments and a shorter 5th gear to improve my setup while using the patch. 2:03.66 without the patch. 2:04.36 with the patch.

With the patch in the GT mod, the tire temps are almost even across the tire while trying to set the tire pressure at 32 psi when warm. As most know, to get 32 psi without the patch requires a higher temperature in the middle of the tire. I may be getting a higher tire pressure with the patch. When I finished a stint with the patch, 3 of 4 tires were at 33 psi whereas 1 of 4 tires was at 33 psi without the patch.

Rob, in the GTs I think you have an advantage without the patch. It's a little more difficult to drive but the difference in lap times is noticeable to me. I could improve my consistency without the patch by slowing down to the lap times I run with the patch. I think there's more room for improvement without the patch than with it, so my difference in lap times may be closer to 1 second per lap instead of .5 seconds. As for other car sets, I have no idea of the differences. I will check it at some point. I'd guess the patch might make the 71 Can Ams a little easier to drive.

#17 mcmirande

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Posted Jan 14 2017 - 09:35 AM

View Postginetto, on Jan 14 2017 - 08:51 AM, said:

It's not faster, it's different; very probably it's slower.
IMHO You can see it as a setup change; anyone can change setup without incurring in cheating, right? :)

I thought the same... if differences are not great and the patch mostly would produce slower laps, it could be used safely.

#18 rcb

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Posted Jan 14 2017 - 10:20 AM

JMF,  the can-am 71's shouldn't be affected at all by the patch.   Their optimal tire pressures are 24psi, which is the same as the bug (24psi).  Thinking about it, was the bug the reason that the 71CA team set the optimals to 24psi originally?

Edited by rcb, Jan 14 2017 - 10:20 AM.


#19 Lee200

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Posted Jan 14 2017 - 10:59 AM

View PostRobert Fleurke, on Jan 14 2017 - 07:21 AM, said:

The question is if this patch can be run undetected and giving an advantage at certain mods, like original 67s!?

I suppose not (since it's aimed at mods with higher ideal tirepressures!?), but I'd like a valid answer anyway ;)

The patch's effect will mainly be seen for those cars that use optimum pressures greatly different from 24 psi.  For the '67 F1 cars which use 24 psi for the front and 26 psi for the rear, I doubt you'll see or feel any difference at all.

The '67 sports cars will certainly be affected as will the upcoming '55 F1 cars which use 40 psi as optimum.  Again, the patch does not affect the tire's grip at all; it merely adjusts the tire's stiffness and the associated slip curve shape a bit.

In all our previous tests, using the patch makes the cars a tiny bit slower instead of faster, but they are easier to control.

#20 MECH

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Posted Jan 14 2017 - 11:35 AM

https://www.youtube....h?v=5_H-LY4Jb2M

 


Bekijk video op YouTube



#21 Cookie

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Posted Jan 14 2017 - 12:15 PM

Yesterday I used the patch with 65s (24/26psi) at Aznom (= Monza reverted)
IMO the patch is not faster, but the tires do not overheat so easy and the right front tire keeps controllable many laps full pushing ;)

#22 Robert Fleurke

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Posted Jan 14 2017 - 12:27 PM

View PostLee200, on Jan 14 2017 - 10:59 AM, said:

View PostRobert Fleurke, on Jan 14 2017 - 07:21 AM, said:

The question is if this patch can be run undetected and giving an advantage at certain mods, like original 67s!?

I suppose not (since it's aimed at mods with higher ideal tirepressures!?), but I'd like a valid answer anyway ;)

The patch's effect will mainly be seen for those cars that use optimum pressures greatly different from 24 psi.  For the '67 F1 cars which use 24 psi for the front and 26 psi for the rear, I doubt you'll see or feel any difference at all.

The '67 sports cars will certainly be affected as will the upcoming '55 F1 cars which use 40 psi as optimum.  Again, the patch does not affect the tire's grip at all; it merely adjusts the tire's stiffness and the associated slip curve shape a bit.

In all our previous tests, using the patch makes the cars a tiny bit slower instead of faster, but they are easier to control.

Thanks for explaining Lee. :)

#23 Border Reiver

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Posted Jan 14 2017 - 04:06 PM

View PostLee200, on Jan 14 2017 - 10:59 AM, said:

....
In all our previous tests, using the patch makes the cars a tiny bit slower instead of faster, but they are easier to control.

That all makes sense as do the results of Greg's tests. Before the tyre behaviour in 67 GT was non-optimal as the tyres were effectively over inflated (as far as part of the code thought) and so benefited from lower rolling resistance hence the higher top speeds and better laptimes that Greg sees somewhere like Bathhurst, but will have been stiffer and less complement and so don't feel so nice or forgiving or consistent. Overall I'd entirely expect what Greg sees and feels with slower laptimes for the same setups with the patch compared to unpatched, but also more consistency. It is also interesting that the brake bug seems to show up less which I guess is due to the tyres operating slightly further away from the grip budget condition that triggers the faulty logic which causes that bug.

Of course, an option to recover some top speed when using the pressure bug patch, at the expense of again having over stiff tyres, would be to over inflate the tyres again, so operate at e.g. 35 psi when warm, like the setup tweak used by some at e.g. Reims to get more top speed due to lower rolling resistance on the straights at the expense of slightly degraded handling. In that way it might well be possible to get back to basically the same effectively unpatched state of car setup for tracks where that is an advantage, but while still using the patch, but still also benefit on slower and twistier tracks where there would be no logical reason to effectively over inflate the tyres as the flawed original code forced if you wanted to get the tyres hot enough to get to peak grip. The point is though that Lee's patch corrects a bug that shouldn't have been there in the first place and by using the patch the physics works more as it was intended to and the setups behave more sensibly and predictably. I am pretty sure that there is no direct advantage or "cheat" by using the patch and it seems mostly to make laptimes slower overall when in use.

Rob

#24 Michkov

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Posted Jan 14 2017 - 04:33 PM

View PostLee200, on Jan 14 2017 - 10:59 AM, said:

The '67 sports cars will certainly be affected as will the upcoming '55 F1 cars which use 40 psi as optimum.  Again, the patch does not affect the tire's grip at all; it merely adjusts the tire's stiffness and the associated slip curve shape a bit.


Will the patch be implemented in the 55 mod, or do we have to apply it separately?

#25 mcmirande

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Posted Jan 14 2017 - 11:22 PM

I'm sorry but I want to know if I understood. Front tires of the original gpl cars should behave the same with or without the patch, isn't it?

Only that, with the patch, the rear ones will have to reach 26 psi to get optimum contact with the asphalt (i.e. in straigth line and cambers = 0 we'll have the same temperatures in the three treads of the tires)?

If so... hardening the rear end or whatever necessary to get 2 more psi in the rear tires than without the patch, the behaviour of the car should be exactly the same?

Thanks and I'm sorry if you explained it multiple times...

Cheers and thanks for all the contributions and explanations in this thread!

Marcos

#26 Lee200

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Posted Jan 15 2017 - 09:05 AM

View PostMichkov, on Jan 14 2017 - 04:33 PM, said:

Will the patch be implemented in the 55 mod, or do we have to apply it separately?

It will be included.

View Postmcmirande, on Jan 14 2017 - 11:22 PM, said:

I'm sorry but I want to know if I understood. Front tires of the original gpl cars should behave the same with or without the patch, isn't it?

Don't do anything different with your tire pressures with the patch.  Try to achieve a pressure of 24 psi for the fronts and 26 psi for the rears after the tires are warmed up.

Edited by Lee200, Jan 15 2017 - 09:06 AM.


#27 mcmirande

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Posted Jan 15 2017 - 11:52 AM

Thanks Lee.

Cheers

#28 mcmirande

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Posted Jan 16 2017 - 06:06 PM

Among the available mods, the patch is included only in the canam66?

#29 Cookie

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Posted Jan 16 2017 - 06:47 PM

View Postmcmirande, on Jan 16 2017 - 06:06 PM, said:

Among the available mods, the patch is included only in the canam66?

Yes Marcos :up:

#30 ACHIM KRAFT

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Posted Jan 29 2017 - 10:56 AM

Hi all !


First, many thanks to Lee for this patch.

Second, i install it today and start testing.

I try it for now with the 67-cars at a simple highspeed track (Grenzlandring Wegeberg) and it feel "subjective" better with a bit more control in general and higher feedback-forces on my wheel, earlyer grip with cold tires and not much lost for laptime. I did not change anything on my setup, to get a feeling of the difference.

Further i will test it with other mods i like (65 / 69 / 69X and TC2). This will during some weeks.


Greetings

Achim




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