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Force feedback update for GPL


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#41 BrettSRMZ

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Posted Feb 23 2014 - 02:30 AM

This is brilliant, G27 user, 0,0,150.  The FFB is just brilliant now.

#42 isamu

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Posted Sep 14 2015 - 11:03 PM

What ever happened to Brr? Br if you're out there, hope you're OK mate.

#43 Paul Harwood

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Posted Aug 01 2017 - 10:30 PM

Hi all.

Enter the time machine and its now summer of 2017! I have just returned to online sim racing thanks to Lou Magyar and the LoPeN league.

When I left sim racing in 2010 a patch for rFactor called 'Real Feel' was still being integrated into various rF mods. I liked it and preferred it to what were called 'canned' FF effects.

This GPL ff2 patch seems very similar. Am I right?

I have installed the patch and set my core.ini values to zero latency and damping and 300 torque.


I have a few questions concerning some settings options.

1- You mention wheel software. Are you referring to Windows device properties, or in my case, Logitech's Wingman app., which is seldom used? Is the Wingman app supposed to be running?

2- in the Windows Device properties there are a few options not discussed here yet: The checkboxes!

enable force feedback checkbox  = checked (?)

overall effects strength 100%
spring effect strength 0
damper effect strength 0

enable centering spring in FF Games checkbox = checked (?)
centering spring strength 0

Allow game to adjust settings checkbox = checked (?)

3- For online racing: The IGOR checkboxes and settings!

In IGOR/ 'join race' tab ...

options ...
Override Force feedback checkbox = unchecked (?)
FF settings... / ForceForm tab
Enable Force Feedback  checkbox = unchecked (?)

Default values entered: (I tried to change these but the changes revert back to these values.)
Damping 40.0
latency 0.085
Torque 225.0

Thanks.

I like the concept but as with rF 'Real Feel' this ff2 patch seems that it will require a fair amount of tweaking to get right.

I note that using centering spring was still a question mark back in 2007-2010 as in-game physics were still not handling this right.

Also, the biggest obvious difference between sim and real world was the feel of the steering when the car is fully stopped. The front wheels should be REALLY hard to move, almost impossible to move the steering wheel until some forward motion is initiated.

Thoughts on these concepts in this ff2 path?

I am personally looking for immediate sensation from my wheel when I initiate a turn. I would like to feel the grit of the track as I turn. I am not getting that atm but I am still trying to tweek the settings

In rFactor. "Real Feel' was only supported by a few mods at first. By 2010, there was talk of rF having Real Feel fully integrated in rF2. Are all GPL mods (2017) compatible with ff2?

Many thanks for your help.

Cheers.

PH

Edited by Paul Harwood, Aug 01 2017 - 10:37 PM.


#44 Paul Harwood

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Posted Aug 01 2017 - 10:37 PM

Hi again,

Also, what about the core.ini value for "FFB steer vibe freq mult = 0.2000000" ?? What does this do?

Thanks.

Edited by Paul Harwood, Aug 01 2017 - 11:09 PM.


#45 Cookie

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Posted Aug 02 2017 - 03:38 AM

Did you do a fresh install with the all-in-one-installer 1.08?

Never saw this line in a GPL core.ini - "FFB steer vibe freq mult = 0.2000000"

I use FFB2 from the beginning, 0-0-380 with a little centering 25% to feel the car when standing.
Wingman profiler is not needed to autorun, but it helps to have the wheel calibrated sometimes.

With Linux-wine all works same, except there is no centering force possible.

#46 Bob Simpson

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Posted Aug 02 2017 - 10:11 AM

1 - I always recommend that, unless you need to re-map buttons, the Logitech profiler NOT be running.

2 - I use:
Enable FF (checked)
OA effects strength 105%
Spring and Damper at 0%
Centring spring unchecked
Allow game to adjust unchecked

With my G25, I use rotation of 540° and in-game my steering ratio is 1 to 9 or 10

I don't know what the settings in iGOR are used for, but I don't use them

In core.ini, I set the max_steering_torque = 310 and arrived at that by turning the steering wheel at a stop on a straight and using a setting that will cause the front wheels to go straight on their own (hands off the wheel) when I move forward.  More force (a smaller number) can be used to suit your tastes.

Edited by Bob Simpson, Aug 02 2017 - 10:17 AM.


#47 Paul Harwood

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Posted Aug 02 2017 - 11:15 AM

Thanks for the replies!!!

1- Profiler .... That's what that thing is called .... I am not running it atm.

2- Hmmm I will uncheck a few boxes and check that out.

I am using a Logitech MOMO Racing ff wheel ...

I will ignore IGOR settings. I was not using them anyway.

Very interesting to hear how you arrive at your max steering torque setting !!!

Thanks for the replies guys!!!

Cheers.

PH

#48 Paul Harwood

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Posted Aug 02 2017 - 07:00 PM

Hi Axel,

This is a relatively new install with the latest installer.

That "FFB steer vibe freq mult = 0.2000000" line appears in the actual core.ini file and is in the right hand comments column! I tried halving the value and that seems  ...interesting.

Cheers.

PH

#49 Paul Harwood

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Posted Aug 02 2017 - 09:32 PM

Hey Petteri!

Thanks so much for this great GPL add-on! It is exactly what I was hoping to find, coming back to GPL racing. Amazing!

Thanks Bob for your settings info and all for this excellent add-on thread! :D B) :)

Cheers.

PH

#50 Stefan Roess

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Posted Aug 03 2017 - 03:08 AM

Hello Paul Harwood.

I guess you have seen this:
http://www.gplworld....tion-guide.html

Close to the end of the guide you find my settings for my Thrustmaster T500 RS wheel.
Even so you have a different wheel it might be worth a try, to get a different feeling.

At my guide I also list Force Feedback v2 (FFB2) Patch (see 3.4), but honestly I don`t use this patch.
My listed wheel settings are for default GPL. I think I should have mentioned this in my guide. :( Maybe I will update it again.
I tried the FFB2 patch as I was updating my guide the last time, but I didn`t take the time to fiddle with adjusting all my settings (as I was a bit under time preassure to get the guide ready before the release of the 55 mod ;) ), as the settings I use didn`t feel good for me anymore. But that is just subjective. I am sure I would also find settings for FFB2 I would feel comfortable with.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Edit: With the Thrustmaster Firmware 41 I have to use the Force Feedback v2 (FFB2) Patch. Without the Force Feedback v2 (FFB2) Patch my Thrustmaster T500 RS won`t work anymore properly with GPL. The forces are way to strong and it makes no difference which values I set for FF in the core.ini or in GEM+.

In GEM+ I have now set controls using the FFB2 Patch to:
FF Latency: 0
FF Damping: 40
FF Maximum Force: 550


With above GEM+ settings the core.ini looks like this:
[ Joy ]
allow_force_feedback = 1   ; Use FF if device has it 0 = No *  1 = Yes
force_feedback_damping = 40   ; force feedback damping coefficient - Default = 40.0
force_feedback_latency = 0 ; force feedback latency (secs) - Default = 0.085   0.0040000
max_steering_torque = 550 ; steering torque in N*in giving max device force - Default = 225.0
      ;FFB steer vibe freq mult = 0.2000000

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I just can tell you to spend much time on testing different settings to finally find the settings you feel comfortable with. You can spend hours with testing settings. But it is worth it. :)
Always take the same car with the same setup on the same track and make little changes on the wheel settings, step by step.
The same thing you should do when testing graphics settings.

Edited by Stefan Roess, May 05 2018 - 03:38 PM.


#51 Cookie

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Posted Aug 03 2017 - 04:08 AM

Ah, but this is just a comment, so nothing will happen if you change a value...

[ Joy ]
allow_force_feedback = 1 ; Use FF if device has it 0 = No * 1 = Yes
force_feedback_damping = 0 ; force feedback damping coefficient - Default = 40.0
force_feedback_latency = 0 ; force feedback latency (secs) - Default = 0.085 0.0040000
max_steering_torque = 380 ; steering torque in N*in giving max device
     ;FFB steer vibe freq mult = 0.2000000

#52 Iestyn16

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Posted Aug 08 2017 - 05:41 PM

Interestingly, now using the black momo, the wheel felt much smoother when I was running the Logitech profiler, so I would advise to run it with the momo

#53 Stefan Roess

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Posted Aug 09 2017 - 03:07 AM

View PostCookie, on Aug 03 2017 - 04:08 AM, said:

Ah, but this is just a comment, so nothing will happen if you change a value...

[ Joy ]
allow_force_feedback = 1 ; Use FF if device has it 0 = No * 1 = Yes
force_feedback_damping = 0 ; force feedback damping coefficient - Default = 40.0
force_feedback_latency = 0 ; force feedback latency (secs) - Default = 0.085 0.0040000
max_steering_torque = 380 ; steering torque in N*in giving max device
     ;FFB steer vibe freq mult = 0.2000000

Axel, these settings are intended for me to test with the FFB2 patch?

#54 Cookie

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Posted Aug 09 2017 - 09:49 AM

This are my G27 settings with FFB2, but I aimed it to Paul who talked about changing the
"     ;FFB steer vibe freq mult = 0.2000000 " value ;)


#55 Stefan Roess

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Posted May 05 2018 - 03:35 PM

This might be of interest for Thrustmaster wheel users.
With the new Thrustmaster Firmware 41 I have to use the Force Feedback v2 (FFB2) Patch for my Thrustmaster T500 RS.
It seems like something has changed with that latest Firmware the way GPL reads the forces.
Without the FFB2 patch I can not run GPL anymore. The forces are way to strong and feel very strange.
Now I am using these GPL Force Feedback settings:
See my post #50 above.

#56 Pete Gaimari

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Posted May 07 2018 - 07:28 AM

I use the default settings in core for my Fanatec and then make adjustments for strength, centering etc on the wheel itself. I don't use this patch. It doesn't feel right.




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