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Grand Prix Legends 1955 F1 Promotion Movie


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#121 mcmirande

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Posted Dec 28 2016 - 10:17 PM

A question about tyres. Does somebody know when synthetic rubber was introduced to F1?

#122 maddog

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Posted Dec 29 2016 - 04:30 AM

Visual evidence for synthetics, came at around 1963-4, when blue smoke became a common sight, on overstressed tyres during cornering, although F1 tyres were not usually pushed to such limits. B)

#123 David Wright Lo67

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Posted Dec 29 2016 - 10:32 AM

View Postmaddog, on Dec 29 2016 - 04:30 AM, said:

Visual evidence for synthetics, came at around 1963-4, when blue smoke became a common sight, on overstressed tyres during cornering, although F1 tyres were not usually pushed to such limits. B)

Please not the blue smoke debate again :)

Synthetic rubber was introduced to F1 racing tyres by Dunlop in 1961 with the wet R12 compound.

Another major breakthrough was the replacement of cotton by nylon for carcass construction in 1958.

#124 mcmirande

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Posted Dec 29 2016 - 02:32 PM

Thanks for the info!

So, 1955 cars had REAL rubber :)

#125 Michkov

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Posted Dec 31 2016 - 01:01 PM

Out of curiosity I tried to figure out what a good rank time would be for the 55ers. Slight problem I ran into is that the Dutch GP ran in the rain, drizzle is reported. Qualy and race times are pretty even but as I dont know if it rained on Saturday or not I figured I ask what the sim times are for Zandy?

#126 gliebzeit

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Posted Dec 31 2016 - 01:16 PM

The '55 Mod will not be released with race-specific cars/drivers or realistic race-specific performance AI files.  There will be one 'generic' set of cars/drivers with season-average tuned AI performance.

There may be add-ons for race-specific carsets, AI files for these, and completion of the '55 conversion beta track add-ons at a later date.

As for rank times.... we need another team member(s) to respond to that.

#127 Pete Gaimari

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Posted Dec 31 2016 - 03:36 PM

Don't use an alien to set the rank times. Do the cars match the real times at all?

#128 Iestyn16

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Posted Jan 04 2017 - 08:29 PM

In the 555, I have a time of 1:40.51 for Zandvoort, with 1:39.87 on pribluda. Hawthorn had a 1:41.5 from 1955, pole was 1:40.0 Fangio. However, there is now a renewed discussion on brake fade, due to the recent extra data.

For the ten original season circuits (in a mix of cars), I had a time of 31:15. That gives a rank of -0.6, for the 6 times compared to the pole times of the 6 raced GPs (usual method for GPLrank benchmarks: 14:19.2), with time left on the table in car selection and particularly at Spa67.

Interestingly, there is a kerfuffle over the fastest lap time. Wikipedia was likely wrong (1:48.3 Mieres), maybe due to an old source (?), but it sounds like a slightly wet lap time to me. ChicaneF1 says 1:40.9 by Mieres on lap 3. However, Motorsport Magazine's archives describe early running in the 1:44s, with 1:43s by lap 20, which sounds correct for heavy fuel and it gradually wearing off, yet it states a 1:40.9 for Mieres on the second lap! GrandPrix.com (http://www.grandprix.../gpe/rr046.html - reports were written by Joe Saward) says that the rain came late in the race. I have amended the Wikipedia fastest lap to 1:40.9, as cited in the Formula1.com source.

Some nice extra details in the Motorsport Magazine archive - such as the different Mercedes cars, Lancia and Vanwall's withdrawals, leading to Castellotti and Hawthorn going to Ferrari, and a 625 there for practice without Farina, due to his mooted retirement (same reason for Gould buying Bira's car). I think it's fair to say that Farina (and Bira?) might have continued racing a bit longer, if not for the Le Mans disaster. Farina went on to make two attempts on the Indy 500.

http://second-a-lap....-prijs-van.html - This adds that Hermann and Bayol were still injured, leaving an unraced Mercedes and a debut for da Silva Ramos. Also, Mercedes had a private test at the circuit on Friday morning! I like the picture of Pollet 'waving' Castellotti though with the 'GPL arm' ;)

https://s-media-cach...b9e72fafdc6.jpg - Fangio and Moss heading into Schievlak
https://www.youtube....h?v=OA_Q8uz16-k - British Pathé footage of the race

#129 davef

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Posted Jan 04 2017 - 09:01 PM

More stats here :

http://www.silhouet..../1955/f155.html

#130 Pete Gaimari

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Posted Jan 05 2017 - 08:39 AM

View PostIestyn16, on Jan 04 2017 - 08:29 PM, said:

In the 555, I have a time of 1:40.51 for Zandvoort, with 1:39.87 on pribluda. Hawthorn had a 1:41.5 from 1955, pole was 1:40.0 Fangio. However, there is now a renewed discussion on brake fade, due to the recent extra data.

For the ten original season circuits (in a mix of cars), I had a time of 31:15. That gives a rank of -0.6, for the 6 times compared to the pole times of the 6 raced GPs (usual method for GPLrank benchmarks: 14:19.2), with time left on the table in car selection and particularly at Spa67.

Interestingly, there is a kerfuffle over the fastest lap time. Wikipedia was likely wrong (1:48.3 Mieres), maybe due to an old source (?), but it sounds like a slightly wet lap time to me. ChicaneF1 says 1:40.9 by Mieres on lap 3. However, Motorsport Magazine's archives describe early running in the 1:44s, with 1:43s by lap 20, which sounds correct for heavy fuel and it gradually wearing off, yet it states a 1:40.9 for Mieres on the second lap! GrandPrix.com (http://www.grandprix.../gpe/rr046.html - reports were written by Joe Saward) says that the rain came late in the race. I have amended the Wikipedia fastest lap to 1:40.9, as cited in the Formula1.com source.

Some nice extra details in the Motorsport Magazine archive - such as the different Mercedes cars, Lancia and Vanwall's withdrawals, leading to Castellotti and Hawthorn going to Ferrari, and a 625 there for practice without Farina, due to his mooted retirement (same reason for Gould buying Bira's car). I think it's fair to say that Farina (and Bira?) might have continued racing a bit longer, if not for the Le Mans disaster. Farina went on to make two attempts on the Indy 500.

http://second-a-lap....-prijs-van.html - This adds that Hermann and Bayol were still injured, leaving an unraced Mercedes and a debut for da Silva Ramos. Also, Mercedes had a private test at the circuit on Friday morning! I like the picture of Pollet 'waving' Castellotti though with the 'GPL arm' ;)

https://s-media-cach...b9e72fafdc6.jpg - Fangio and Moss heading into Schievlak
https://www.youtube....h?v=OA_Q8uz16-k - British Pathé footage of the race


So, you're -75 Rank in the 67 F1 cars show you qualify as an alien. If you can just barely squeak out the times of the real 55 cars. It shows how difficult they are to drive.

I'm fine with that as long as you guys think what you have is realistic. I never want the cars easier to drive than the real cars, but I don't want them harder either. It sounds like you have the mod pretty close.

#131 Iestyn16

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Posted Jan 05 2017 - 12:18 PM

Yep, it's pretty close and there is still discussion on improving it! To be fair, I'm using a Saitek r220, now that my G25 motor has stopped working, so I'm only about -50 pace in the original GPL cars, without ffb and using such a low detailed wheel/pedal set.

#132 PTRACER

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Posted Jan 10 2017 - 10:25 PM

View PostSaiph, on Dec 17 2016 - 05:15 PM, said:

Ok. Thanks for the explanation. The look of the Streamliner always confused me about the rules for F1 at that time.

Well, nothing in the rules stated the car had to be an openwheeler ;) Basically, you need to stop thinking of Formula 1 as a championship which started in 1950. It's factually incorrect, but everyone learns it that way because it's easier.

I wrote an extensive article on the subject once, but just to quote the important bit that answers your post.

"Technically, there was no such thing as a Formula 1 car in those days. The cars could be open or closed cockpit, open or closed wheeled, could have a front, rear or mid-mounted engine, be RWD, FWD or 4WD and did not even have to be single-seaters! This meant cars built for Formula 2 or Formula 3 spec racing and even two seater sportscars were eligible providing they were not dangerously outclassed/uncompetitive."

Further explained here: http://www.the-fastl...=194663#p194663

Edited by PTRACER, Jan 10 2017 - 10:27 PM.


#133 Splaywheeler

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Posted Jan 12 2017 - 08:46 AM

First of all thanks to the mod team for working on the 55 carset, and for the new features that driving these cars will bring.  Waiting is a long game, but someone has to do it :zzzzz: so a few weeks/months more in order to have it correct is well worth it IMHO.

I notice in previous discussions that there is interest in Davidstowe Airfield  in Cornwall.  I happen to know that Magnus Rubensson ( who has now retired from GPL but whom I still have occasional contact with)  worked on a beta version of that track and had a very basic tarmac only version. I am often in that area and have driven around what is left of the airfield, dodging sheep and huge potholes and most definitely NOT at racing speed. I might be able to rustle up a few photos etc if  they are of use to anyone contemplating working on that track.

#134 Michkov

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Posted Jan 12 2017 - 05:49 PM

Period pictures would be really helpful. Especially of the first turn esses of the later layout. My guess is they put obstacles on the runway to create a chicane, as to what these obstacles were I have no idea.

#135 Splaywheeler

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Posted Jan 13 2017 - 08:48 AM

From my experience the sheep worked quite well!!! But getting them to stay in one place might be an issue ;)

I will do some digging in my own photo archives and maybe see If Magnus ( who still resides in Cornwall) still has any files/data.

#136 webfoot

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Posted Jan 14 2017 - 04:21 AM

This might be useful, a few copies on Amazon as well....

http://www.ebay.co.u...GoAAOSwcLxYD3Ic

#137 timbob67

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Posted Jan 18 2017 - 10:15 AM

View PostIestyn16, on Dec 23 2016 - 10:31 AM, said:

View PostMichkov, on Dec 21 2016 - 06:39 PM, said:

View PostIestyn16, on Dec 21 2016 - 02:28 PM, said:

For the third time (Kettle fused twice :faint: ), I think Davidstow is the only one no one has had a go at, and I tried tracing it out but wasn't 100% accurate. Not sure on Albi '55.


Did you find any pictures during your research for the track? I've been toying with the idea of trying my hand at it as it seems an "easy" track for a novice. But material on the web is scarce. All I was able to find is the S/F area, and the obligatory deserted runways filled with sheep.

Just what I could find on Google, looks like that book would be the definitive source. Yes, exactly! Perfect for a 'beginner' track to make. You can even start with the simpler version then add in the esses/shortcut. Those sheep look ripe for a track side mip!

The Davidstow book is an excellent resource. When the W196 Mercedes appeared for rFactor (10+ years ago?) I decided Davidstow would be a good track to "cut my teeth" on... I bought the book, a local chap took a bunch of photos as the airfield is today, and I got as far as a properly traced and scaled, working track I could razz about on with solid haybales, placeholder textures and a crudely build scaffolding grandstand. I'd describe it as a crude pre-alpha, enthusiastic beginner's first track...

I don't have any of the files now, and have only just reinstalled GPL after at least a 10 year absence, so I might have another bash!

#138 gliebzeit

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Posted Jan 18 2017 - 11:02 AM

timbo67,  your comment on making an alpha of Davidstow for sim racing was cool !!  I certainly hope that you do "have another bash" at building this track for G.P.L.  It is always invigorating to have an old 10-year returnee check in here.... even better to see his imagining of a beloved track.  Welcome back and thank you!  :)

#139 Wee Scot

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Posted Feb 13 2017 - 02:37 AM

Really looking forward to this mod, since I was born on this day... in 1955!

B)

#140 Andreh

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Posted Feb 13 2017 - 05:56 PM

Happy Birthday!




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