Jump to content


- - - - -

Unbelievable The Time That You Lose Shift/Gamepad


  • Please log in to reply
287 replies to this topic

#1 svenvangent

svenvangent

    Denny Hulme

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,001 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Interests:GPl natuurlijk .... what else !
    And Projectcars perhaps !
  • Sim interest:I have no preference

Posted Sep 30 2011 - 01:22 PM

Unbelievable the time that you lose racing/shift with the gamepad or racing with a wheel :shock:
Just done a comparison with Georg B at Sachsenring 1967 and his speedshift/gearshift .
See picture .
greets

Attached Files


Edited by svenvangent, Oct 15 2011 - 05:51 PM.


#2 brr

brr

    a GPL editor

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,244 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Sim interest:GPL

Posted Sep 30 2011 - 01:35 PM

Normal upshift time spent in neutral is about 0.22 seconds even with a wheel using paddle shifters, anything faster suggests an H-shifter and an accompanying change in physics. It seems your gamepad shifting times are normal.

#3 sky

sky

    ultra highres junkie & 917 addict

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,550 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:the last haven for petrolheads
  • Interests:travel, music, racing, vintage cars, model cars
  • Sim interest:GPL

Posted Sep 30 2011 - 01:35 PM

you realize that his are mostly speedshifts? says so at the top of the screen: 12 out of 15 upshifts were speedshifts, whereas you didn't a single time.
so he's like gear, full throttle (gear).
you are full throttle, neutral, gear, full throttle

spot the difference ;)

#4 svenvangent

svenvangent

    Denny Hulme

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,001 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Interests:GPl natuurlijk .... what else !
    And Projectcars perhaps !
  • Sim interest:I have no preference

Posted Sep 30 2011 - 01:41 PM

Brr thanks for the reply  :hat-tip:

Sky , yes i saw that he was doing speedshift but if i try too do that mostly it is :fireworks2:  boem patat :fireworks4:  with my engine :rolleyes:
greets

Edited by svenvangent, Sep 30 2011 - 01:42 PM.


#5 s2173

s2173

    Skymole

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 285 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Sofia, Bulgaria
  • Interests:Everything

Posted Sep 30 2011 - 02:09 PM

I don't think its because he's speedshifting... I tried both and they both give me 0.222 secs, but without speedshifting I'm around 5-10 kmh slower. So I guess time spend in neutral doesn't matter much, its the same in both occasions. He is probably using heel/toe or some other pro technique to shift so fast...

I allways run with damage off when lapping around, both because I'm faster when speedshifting and to minimize frustration... which is very important with tracks like Sachsenring... btw, I cant get the hang of that track... the surface feels like even mix of molasses and ice, with some train rails spread randomly on top...

#6 MECH

MECH

    Double poly killer

  • Administrators
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,408 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Here ->
  • Interests:My Girlfriend
  • Sim interest:GPL

Posted Sep 30 2011 - 02:12 PM

View Postsvenvangent, on Sep 30 2011 - 01:41 PM, said:

Brr thanks for the reply  :hat-tip:

Sky , yes i saw that he was doing speedshift but if i try too do that mostly it is :fireworks2:  boem patat :fireworks4:  with my engine :rolleyes:
greets

Does that come with the smell of french fries as well?  :rofl:

#7 Pete Gaimari

Pete Gaimari

    Jim Clark

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,561 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Colorado
  • Interests:Racing and Muzzleloader Hunting
  • Sim interest:GPL

Posted Sep 30 2011 - 02:59 PM

Time lost is not quite as dramatic as it seems. The car doesn't come to a stop when you shift.

#8 Greg

Greg

    Denny Hulme

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 192 posts
  • Location:Warren, Pa., US
  • Sim interest:GPL

Posted Sep 30 2011 - 03:12 PM

I have to use autoshift which I'm told adds 0.20 seconds per shift.  Averages about 6 to 8 seconds per lap slower for me than the fast guys in the leagues I'm in.

#9 Jhalli

Jhalli

    Denny Hulme

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 293 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Finland
  • Sim interest:GPL

Posted Sep 30 2011 - 03:15 PM

View Postsvenvangent, on Sep 30 2011 - 01:41 PM, said:

Brr thanks for the reply  :hat-tip:

Sky , yes i saw that he was doing speedshift but if i try too do that mostly it is :fireworks2:  boem patat :fireworks4:  with my engine :rolleyes:
greets


why not use Damage mode = none,

you cant explode it  :rolleyes:

#10 svenvangent

svenvangent

    Denny Hulme

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,001 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Interests:GPl natuurlijk .... what else !
    And Projectcars perhaps !
  • Sim interest:I have no preference

Posted Sep 30 2011 - 03:21 PM

View PostMECH, on Sep 30 2011 - 02:12 PM, said:

View Postsvenvangent, on Sep 30 2011 - 01:41 PM, said:

Brr thanks for the reply  :hat-tip:

Sky , yes i saw that he was doing speedshift but if i try too do that mostly it is :fireworks2:  boem patat :fireworks4:  with my engine :rolleyes:
greets

Does that come with the smell of french fries as well?  :rofl:

smells like teen spirit :P

#11 svenvangent

svenvangent

    Denny Hulme

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,001 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Interests:GPl natuurlijk .... what else !
    And Projectcars perhaps !
  • Sim interest:I have no preference

Posted Sep 30 2011 - 03:25 PM

View Posts2173, on Sep 30 2011 - 02:09 PM, said:

I don't think its because he's speedshifting... I tried both and they both give me 0.222 secs, but without speedshifting I'm around 5-10 kmh slower. So I guess time spend in neutral doesn't matter much, its the same in both occasions. He is probably using heel/toe or some other pro technique to shift so fast...

I allways run with damage off when lapping around, both because I'm faster when speedshifting and to minimize frustration... which is very important with tracks like Sachsenring... btw, I cant get the hang of that track... the surface feels like even mix of molasses and ice, with some train rails spread randomly on top...
Damage alway's on realistic for me and no automatic shift but manu shift
:hat-tip:

#12 one2fwee

one2fwee

    Denny Hulme

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 320 posts
  • Sim interest:GPL and P&G

Posted Sep 30 2011 - 05:07 PM

I've never used it but i think he must be using gplshift or whatever it's called. All shifts in gpl are 0.222, it's hard coded and the only way to get round this is to alter the physics - gplshift does something like this and basically can allow you to shift as fast as is possible.

I'm not sure if what i've said is correct but i think it probably is. Someone else please correct me though.

So yer it's almost like a bit of a cheat way at gaining time, that can be justifiably offset if you are using the realism of heeltoe - but if you are actually speedshifting too and also not even using manual clutch and lfb then i dunno it seems a bit unfair really. Then again, these rules only really apply to oneself personally - it's stupid to apply them to others - i just like to try and drive in a realistic manner myself :) And also, i could be talking complete :crap:.

#13 Andy Clegg

Andy Clegg

    Denny Hulme

  • Supporter
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 535 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Banbury, UK.
  • Interests:Long distance sports car racing. Touring cars.
  • Sim interest:GPL

Posted Oct 01 2011 - 09:17 AM

Sven, that's what I was getting at before. As you know I use a gamepad also, and I can't get near your times.
Andy

#14 svenvangent

svenvangent

    Denny Hulme

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,001 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Interests:GPl natuurlijk .... what else !
    And Projectcars perhaps !
  • Sim interest:I have no preference

Posted Oct 01 2011 - 09:59 AM

View PostAndy Clegg, on Oct 01 2011 - 09:17 AM, said:

Sven, that's what I was getting at before. As you know I use a gamepad also, and I can't get near your times.
Andy
Hallo Andy ,
Those faster times will come it is a matter of time practice practice and even more grrrrrrr practice .
.
for example , at Adeleide i couldent go for a long time in to the green light and i thought  ... man ... this track don't like me much until one day i took my baby braby out for a ride and...... bingoooooo green (allee just green) :P
In the beginning Kyalami was also a track full of frustrazione .
Ach , and knowing the track the line and a good feeling with the car helps also .
:hat-tip:

Edited by svenvangent, Oct 01 2011 - 10:15 AM.


#15 Andy Clegg

Andy Clegg

    Denny Hulme

  • Supporter
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 535 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Banbury, UK.
  • Interests:Long distance sports car racing. Touring cars.
  • Sim interest:GPL

Posted Oct 02 2011 - 01:13 AM

Thanks Sven for the encouragement, I know I've to keep practising. I drive the cars like I would imagine they'd be driven round a track.

#16 Pete Gaimari

Pete Gaimari

    Jim Clark

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,561 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Colorado
  • Interests:Racing and Muzzleloader Hunting
  • Sim interest:GPL

Posted Oct 02 2011 - 07:16 AM

View PostAndy Clegg, on Oct 02 2011 - 01:13 AM, said:

Thanks Sven for the encouragement, I know I've to keep practising. I drive the cars like I would imagine they'd be driven round a track.

That would depend on who you're talking about. Like Jim Clark who was smooth, or like Rindt who will be sideways and sliding. :)

Edited by Pete Gaimari, Oct 02 2011 - 07:16 AM.


#17 Andy Clegg

Andy Clegg

    Denny Hulme

  • Supporter
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 535 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Banbury, UK.
  • Interests:Long distance sports car racing. Touring cars.
  • Sim interest:GPL

Posted Oct 02 2011 - 09:38 AM

Pete, I try and keep it smooth but maybe that's why I'm slow.

Attached Files



#18 John Woods

John Woods

    Be Somebody

  • Supporter
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,511 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Interests:Too Much Fun
  • Sim interest:GPL

Posted Oct 02 2011 - 10:47 AM

Lots of interesting ideas...

One of the keys to success is to think incrementally. You may find that reaching a plateau, where it seems you will never get better, is only a waiting time until the next climb up. Sometimes it happens real fast, but you have to be patient. So while being patient, there is lots of time for experiment, especially with base parameters like driving as one imagines someone would on a real track. "What we can imagine" is one of the major hurdles because it is the total concept of what we are doing. It follows that as what-we-can-imagine-is-possible changes there will be commensurate changes in our performance.
Some recommend very incremental stable change based on a very limited set of parameters, such as, making every effort to be as realistic as possible. Others learn every track one flat out turn at a time. Still others acknowledge the circumstance of enjoying a simulation and accept its advanages over reality as part of their real experience as a user. So they may readily install utilities like gplshift or change their driver view.
Some become hotlappers, some enjoy online leagues with strict rules about participation. Each has a very different approach to Grand Prix Legends. Hotlappers I'm guessing mostly run no damage with low fuel loads compared to online endurance racers who have to finish to place, so may have a very different way settiing up a car and driving.

Edited by John Woods, Oct 02 2011 - 11:10 AM.


#19 Andy Clegg

Andy Clegg

    Denny Hulme

  • Supporter
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 535 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Banbury, UK.
  • Interests:Long distance sports car racing. Touring cars.
  • Sim interest:GPL

Posted Oct 02 2011 - 11:19 AM

Hi John, I always enjoy your answers to these questions, thanks. I try and learn the circuits and then go hopefully faster. Sometimes I download World Record Replays and then see where I'm slower and use that as an example to be faster. A lot of people are advising me, and for me this is most helpful. I suppose that this is what the GPL Forums are all about (helping each other).

#20 one2fwee

one2fwee

    Denny Hulme

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 320 posts
  • Sim interest:GPL and P&G

Posted Oct 02 2011 - 03:02 PM

A question i've always had and don't know how to find the answer (but i imagine it's using some magic in gpl race engineer) is how do you find out if it's better to change down for a corner or stay in a higher gear and just use that one.

For example, coming out of lesmos and parabolica in the lotus is actually a lot faster in 3rd gear rather than going down to second and having to make the shift up to third actually loses you time (maybe because of the set amount of time gpl forces on you to make a shift? Or would it be just as bad in real life anyway?).
In other cars and other corners, it is much more difficult to decide which gives the better drive out of the corner, and whether it is worth staying in a higher gear or not. I really have no idea in the cooper what i should do.
I try to judge it in terms of whether it's possible to slide the car slightly under acceleration in the higher gear and if so then it's okay but this method seems a bit of a false friend as i think for some reason it can make you think the higher gear is adequate even when it's not.

If anyone knows that would be a great help, thanks.




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

Sim Racing Links