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Anisotropic Filtering And Weird Interactions With Antialiasing


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#1 bingo

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Posted Jan 11 2020 - 08:25 PM

Hi - I've possibly come back here again after real life dealt me a really bad hand this last year (that's why I suddenly left after making only a few sounds back in January).

Anyway, I cannot for the life of me get GPL to run nicely. I have yet to find a balance of performance, functional anti-alias, and non-blurry texture filtering.

My best attempt so far using nvidia profile inspector is this:
OGLv2, 50 LOD bias,
32xCSAA (seemingly does nothing AT ALL for jaggy pixels, but anything else means the dials on the dashboard go all wobbly/torn for no reason? Also, something is needed in this setting to enable the transparency supersampling (even though it's called that, it appears to antialias everything.),
8x Transparency SuperSampling (doing all the work!),
16x Anisotropic Filtering (<here's the problem - it looks like a mega-blurry bilinear filter unless I turn the transparency SuperSampling off entirely, at which point the wheels look smooth-ish, but the dashboard and billboards go wobbly. It gets blurrier the higher the antialias value.)

I can rectify the blurry texture problem and the antialias issues by using a 4K dynamic super resolution, but this absolutely tanks the FPS from 60 to 20-30 in training mode.

I have also tried D3Dv2, in which antialias is great, but anisotropic filtering doesn't work, but in a different way to OGLv2. On the road and on walls, I can see 3 lines very close together where texture detail changes drastically, and armco barriers seem to become 1 pixel tall textures at about 100ft.

I can't wait to do some hotlaps with these problems as just a frustrating memory and not hours of potential anger stretching to infinity!

Edited by bingo, Jan 11 2020 - 09:42 PM.


#2 Cookie

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Posted Jan 11 2020 - 08:42 PM

If intel CPU - Have you checked "disable intel speed step " in GEM ?

For more help we should know your CPU , GPU and OS ;)

#3 bingo

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Posted Jan 11 2020 - 09:13 PM

Yep, that's ticked in GEM.

i7 2600, GTX 660ti (OC), Win7 64 bit.

#4 Ramoats

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Posted Jan 11 2020 - 09:50 PM

Try the video settings for Gem+ and Nvidia cards recommended in Grand Prix Legends (GPL) Easy Installation Guide v2.0

#5 bingo

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Posted Jan 11 2020 - 10:02 PM

View PostRamoats, on Jan 11 2020 - 09:50 PM, said:

Try the video settings for Gem+ and Nvidia cards recommended in Grand Prix Legends (GPL) Easy Installation Guide v2.0

That was my starting point. I have enabled "OGL_FORCE_BLIT_ON" to stop menus from flickering/disappearing, but otherwise it's mainly the same.
The lower spec one gives me a wobbly/tearing/twitchy dashboard, the higher spec one makes the grass/road all blurry, also with wobbly dashboard (the sparse grid supersampling options actually make that effect worse!).
The transparency supersampling appears to be the setting that controls scenery blurriness/dashboard wobbliness, with 8x meaning a perfect dashboard but the blurriest road textures and vice versa.

#6 Millennium

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Posted Jan 12 2020 - 03:39 AM

I'm curious why only nvidia drivers seems to have these issues with GPL?

Last month I bought my first nvidia gpu and I was also getting a lot of problems with GPL too. Including the flickering menu screen, which I could not get rid of.
The nvidia game profiles are a mess in my opinion. So many useless options, with AMD drivers I just select 8x SS, 16x AF and everything looks and runs great.

Edited by Millennium, Jan 12 2020 - 03:44 AM.


#7 bingo

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Posted Jan 12 2020 - 10:16 AM

And to think one of the reasons I swapped to Nvidia was how well my Nvidia 9500GT dealt with GPL vs my AMD HD7770!
I mean, I suppose the 660ti is better than my 7770 performance-wise, but only a little bit. The HD7770 never did this blurry wobbly stuff though.

Edited by bingo, Jan 12 2020 - 10:17 AM.


#8 Stefan Roess

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Posted Jan 12 2020 - 10:41 AM

Bingo, welcome back.
Have you tried my very moderate graphics settings as a start point? See here:
http://www.gplworld....s/gpl-2020-demo

http://www.gplworld...._nvidia_low.jpg

Edit: Looks like you have already tried my low settings.
Are you using the latest drivers available for your card and Windws system?
When I am in front of my PC again (in about 1 week) I can have a look on the settings of my backup GPL league server that has an old Nvidia card. Those stable low settings (for hosting not driving) should easily work on yours as a start point.

I never had such problems with any NVIDIA graphics card I use(d) over the years and GPL. Here is my PC system on bottom of the page: http://www.gplworld....em-requirements

Atm I use an NVIDIA GeForce GTX 970, 4096 MBytes GDDR5 SDRAM, MSI GTX 970 Gaming video card.

Edited by Stefan Roess, Jan 12 2020 - 10:56 AM.


#9 bingo

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Posted Jan 12 2020 - 10:57 AM

Yes I have tried those. With those settings, the antialiasing only seems to work on the tyre edges and the dashboard is all wobbly/torn.

Here are some pictures. I will say the first one is very difficult to see because it's about motion - where you can see a boundary between diagonal lines on the rev counter, there is a "tear", and the texture wobbles around it in motion.
The second one you can see - the ground and logos look like they have motion blur applied to them.

https://imgur.com/a/LJgNrKe

#10 Cookie

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Posted Jan 12 2020 - 10:59 AM

Have you removed all old AMD stuff from your pc?

Use the DDU to clean W7: https://www.guru3d.c...r-download.html

#11 bingo

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Posted Jan 12 2020 - 11:13 AM

Yes, the AMD stuff was cleared out a long time ago now, but I'll give DDU a go just in case.

I have discovered that the wobbly dashboard happens whenever I use a LOD bias above 0, so that's sort of solved.

With a LOD bias of 0, The High settings in this case leave me with aliasing in the distance and shimmery crowds.

So, to summarise: The high settings work, but I can't raise the LOD bias high enough to stop the distance shimmering without my dashboard going funny. Saying that, the distance textures are always doing that wobbly thing the dashboard is doing, no matter what I set the LOD bias to!

Edited by bingo, Jan 12 2020 - 11:31 AM.


#12 Stefan Roess

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Posted Jan 12 2020 - 11:43 AM

Have you tried -50 LOD bias?
In your first post you wrote 50 or did you mean -50?

Edit: I just saw on your pics that you have also tried -50.

Edited by Stefan Roess, Jan 13 2020 - 08:57 AM.


#13 bingo

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Posted Jan 12 2020 - 12:10 PM

I just tried D3Dv2 again, and I can easily get perfect quality graphics going with that (-200 LOD bias stops the weird lines on the road!), but at only at about 30-45 stuttery FPS in the pitlane with 67s. Also, the mirrors have no antialiasing  : (
Much better than OGL in the graphics department though, so maybe trying to fix D3D performance is the way to go instead of trying to tame OGL's weirdness.

Meanwhile in OGLv2 land, MSAA and Sparse Grid Supersampling means no blurry road under the car, but the distance shimmers can't be rectified with LOD bias;
In this setup, when I increase the LOD bias to stop the shimmering, the road/dashboard goes blurry before the distance stops shimmering, so I end up with a blurry dashboard/road AND shimmering distance textures when I raise the LOD bias.

Edited by bingo, Jan 12 2020 - 01:01 PM.


#14 Cookie

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Posted Jan 12 2020 - 04:08 PM

TBH I think for the GTX 660TI with 2GB VRAM - 4K resolution is over the limit.

GPL needs a very good graphics bus between CPU and GPU to manage the loads of small graphics packages...

#15 bingo

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Posted Jan 12 2020 - 08:42 PM

Yeah I would agree - probably too much for this PC to handle; I think it only has SATA 2, so that should tell you enough about how outpaced it is (I have no idea what PCI thingy it has, nor whether that would help). I have somehow got D3Dv2 to give acceptable performance at 36fps with 3x3 SSAA, so that's good enough for me.
I can deal with pixelly mirrors until I upgrade again (which will be while, since I would have to change motherboard (and therefore CPU!) and RAM and GPU all at once to do so.

Edited by bingo, Jan 12 2020 - 08:45 PM.


#16 Cookie

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Posted Jan 13 2020 - 06:36 AM

I wouldn't be so pessimistic, the CPU is strong enough and the GPU has very good chance to give a good full-HD....

Could you reduce the resolution of the monitor to 1920x1080 (at the monitor!) ?

The problematic part is maybe the pci-e bus, is the 660ti in the first x16 slot to have the full 16 lanes?

DL HWINFO64 portable and run "summary only" to see it  ( https://www.hwinfo.com/download/ )
make a snapshot and I can tell if there is a bottleneck  ;)

DL GPU-Z https://www.techpowe...hpowerup-gpu-z/ and "Start render test" to see the used bus interface.

GPL 67s should be not such problematic, if you try the new SCX mod you would have 3fps with D3Dv2...
Most people here prefer openGLV2 as it is much stronger and modern.

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Edited by Cookie, Jan 13 2020 - 07:10 AM.


#17 bingo

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Posted Jan 13 2020 - 09:50 AM

I already have the resolution at 1080p - the 4K was a reference to trying DSR instead of SSAA as antialiasing.

Tests on boths programs indicate PCI-e 2.0 x16 @ x16, so that's probably the bottleneck, right?

I'm of 2 minds - D3D looks perfect but runs badly sometimes, OGL runs perfectly but the track looks like it has bilinear filtering/motion blur all of the time. I guess I'll just swap to OGL whenever D3D is unbearably slow.

Edited by bingo, Jan 13 2020 - 10:54 AM.





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