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Collection Of Replays With Setups For Mods Other Than 67 Original


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#1 prize

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    Denny Hulme

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Posted Sep 16 2020 - 10:15 PM

There is a very large collection of expert track replays (with setups) for the original 67 cars at this link: http://ferdinandschu...etup_ferdi.html
This is a great learning tool, as it allows you to compare your performance vs. a gold standard result on many different tracks using GPL replay analyzer.

Is there a similar collection of replays on many different tracks for more recent mods, such as 65 or 55?

Thanks!

#2 jgf

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Posted Sep 17 2020 - 08:40 AM

There are many setups and some replays at the Track Database, and many sites have hotlap replays for different tracks;  most track creators also post replays on their sites.  I advise against using other peoples' setups other than for reference (look for patterns in specific cars/tracks) as driving styles can be quite different and trying to adapt your style to someone else' setup can b e more difficult than learning to create your own setups, especially when faced with a track for which you can find no setups.  Even which steering wheel you use can make a difference in the setup.  There are many threads here and elsewhere on handling and setups and you will find creating a base setup for the car that works for you and can be taken to any track with minor changes is easier than you think.

Consider in the real world, you have your car seat and steering wheel adjusted for your comfort, loan your car to a friend and they adjust everything to their satisfaction, you get the car back and it is not "right".  Now imagine those personal preferences extending to tire pressures, spring rates, gear ratios, etc.

And be wary of hotlap setups;  they are, obviously, optimized for hotlaps - a light fuel load and relatively cold tires.  Put in even enough fuel for a thirty minute race and get the tires fully warmed up and you typically find the handling ...disappointing.

#3 twinpotter

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Posted Sep 17 2020 - 03:41 PM

I've always preferred to do and find my own setups. No matter how hard it can be. I love the challenge and the immersion of finding my own. I feel better if my setup gives me a good time. It's just fantastic to learn too the art of racing and the black hearts of setups.

I would rather finish last in a race and we'll off the pace, with my own set up, than using online ones. That goes for all my sim racing games. I love it and it gives me an enormous mount of enjoyment to try and try find the secret ingredient.  For me It's part of the fun.

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#4 Tobodestroyer2020

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Posted Sep 19 2020 - 04:52 PM

I used to spend ages looking for the perfect setup. I tried Alison Hines', Greg Huttu's and Steve Cloyds and I did get pretty quick, but I was never the quickest. As JGF says, it felt like driving someone else's car.

I returned to GPL a few months ago after a long break and I've had to relearn everything. I now use H shifter and brake with my right foot and there are so many mods to choose from. All of my setups from the early days now feel horrid; I'm all over the place. So, I've adopted a new approach. Practise!

Set the steering ratio where you want it, adjust the fuel and diff and off you go. Then just practise. The driver is always the key to a fast lap. I find a car that is comfortable and enjoyable to drive lap after lap is way quicker in the long run than a twitchy hire car.

I've even started to enjoy the Sports Cars with the default setups. Learn to tweak them to suit YOUR style of driving and you'll be grinning from ear to ear.


Edit: Back in the day I became obsessed with obtaining a negative rank with the 67 cars. After all, that's all we had. So, I was always looking for the holy-grail of setups... I never found it. Now that we have so many mods and cars to choose from, I find myself having to adapt my driving, almost on a daily basis, to suit the car. Enjoy the fact that everything is different and learn to adapt. As a result of this, I'm now quicker and enjoying GPL so much more this time around. Remember, the RL racers we're given the cars and told to "Get on with it!"

Edited by Tobodestroyer2020, Sep 20 2020 - 01:18 AM.


#5 jgf

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Posted Sep 19 2020 - 09:08 PM

Exactly.  With a full length race you are going to be in that car for two hours. it had better be comfortable.  And when tweaking setups make sure it is the setup that needs adjustment and not the nut behind the wheel;  try different lines, different brake points, etc. at a track or section of a track, and only when you are sure you cannot improve your driving do you alter the setup.

I also occasionally revisit old setups, and am glad there are no witnesses.

FWIW, Alison's setups were good for beginners, stable but not extremely fast (I learned with her "X-Files");  I could never come to grips (pardon the pun) with Huttu's setups, twitchy and tail-happy, I spun with monotonous regularity (but he was amazingly fast;  as in real life - Schumacher was one of the best, but invariably his team mates said his setups were so twitchy they couldn't drive them).

#6 twinpotter

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Posted Sep 20 2020 - 03:58 AM

"and only when you are sure you cannot improve your driving do you alter the setup"

Jgf: I always intend to go out in practice put in a few laps to get me in the groove and acclimatised to the track. Then I come back in (numerous times) tweaking my set up and watching the time differences after each set up. I instantly think that the default set ups are not fast and that I have to go find the secret ingredient. Is this the wrong way to go and incorrect philosophy 🤔

On Schumacher I once watched a documentary and interview with one of his team mates Eddie Irvine. He stated that even though Michael was supreme out on the track (especially when wet) he was clueless on set ups and translating that info to the engineers. So they had to help him with open ended and leading questions. I don't know how much truth there is to this either. Okay he would be probably more knowledgeable than us or any other club racer, but compared to say someone like Senna, he was a little lapse on setting up the car.

TP:

#7 KARTM

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Posted Sep 20 2020 - 08:27 AM

bad exemple Senna  wasnt very good  for the setup  Prost was the man who had the ears of the engineer at mclaren , or  De Angelis at lotus , there some drivers who  notoriously didnt care about the whole process of setup and development , but  there some who are and are alway after the engineer but who are more a nuisance then a help so engineer just pretend to pay attention .im  not sure about Schumacher but it was a different era  with a lot more data gathering device  so  drivers now are a lot less important in that area .

#8 Cookie

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Posted Sep 20 2020 - 09:27 AM

I think Lauda was the best to understand and give the right hints to tweak a car setup.
In his movie it is shown that he saw what's wrong with a car.

Schumi had learned his mechanic job in german dual education system that contains theoretical and practical work. So he knew how to set up a car and wich screw to turn in wich direction....

For me there are two kind of fast drivers
- fast with any setup
- very sensitive if something is not 100% correct but fast when it works (me)

#9 jgf

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Posted Sep 20 2020 - 09:40 AM

There is no "correct" or "incorrect" here, whatever works for you.

But I reiterate - always adapt the setup to your driving, not vice versa.  So you should know the track to the point you are confident nothing you do via driving will substantially improve your laptimes before tweaking the setup.  Otherwise you are fighting on two fronts - learning the track and tweaking the setup, if there is a problem, where is it?  But you need a decent setup to start with;  in this vein I have found Alison Hine's concept of base setups to be good advice for every sim I've had.  Once you've created several setups for one car at different tracks you will notice many parameters rarely change or change very slightly, use this to create a base setup that can be taken to any track for practice and on which to build a specific setup.

Also consider Rick Mears attitude towards handling - when faced with options to adjust the handling, always choose the one that gives more grip.  For a simple example, your car understeers, common options are to increase the rear bar or decrease the front bar, the former decreases grip, the latter increases grip, choose the latter.

As for Schumacher, many drivers in any series are complete technicians, fully fluent in every aspect of the car, as capable as any mechanic with setups and tuning, while other drivers are just drivers, with little to no knowledge, or even interest, in the mechanics of the car.  On track results indicate neither has an advantage.  My point was that here you had a driver who was one of the best, but whose preferred setup was so stiff and twitchy that others found it undriveable, proof that setups are very individual and there is no absolute "best".

I have learned more about setups in 20+ years of racing sims than I did in 35 years of RL racing;  I was a decent analytical driver, capable of telling the crew exactly what was wrong with the handling of a car with a few laps of testing, but had little knowledge or interest in what they did to correct things.

#10 KARTM

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Posted Sep 20 2020 - 10:00 AM

View PostCookie, on Sep 20 2020 - 09:27 AM, said:

I think Lauda was the best to understand and give the right hints to tweak a car setup.
In his movie it is shown that he saw what's wrong with a car.

Schumi had learned his mechanic job in german dual education system that contains theoretical and practical work. So he knew how to set up a car and wich screw to turn in wich direction....

For me there are two kind of fast drivers
- fast with any setup
- very sensitive if something is not 100% correct but fast when it works (me)
Lauda was good , but in the movie "rush"  let say that it was a litlle simplistic no to say comic  , especially whe he explained to the  BRM engineers the importance of the weight  in a race cars :P  , well known drivers good in setup , Stewart ,Piquet. Fittipaldi come to mind but guys like Patrese, Damon hill too

#11 jgf

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Posted Sep 20 2020 - 11:03 AM

View PostCookie, on Sep 20 2020 - 09:27 AM, said:

...
For me there are two kind of fast drivers
- fast with any setup
- very sensitive if something is not 100% correct but fast when it works (me)

This is true in any series, but there are a couple of perfect examples from F1.  Both Nigel Mansel and Jacques Villeneuve were F1 champions, both won the title in cars that were indisputably the best on the track those years, and both were mere mid-pack runners when not in the best equipment.  By comparison you have drivers like Senna, Schumacher, and Stewart, who won races when not in the best equipment, and couldn't be touched when in the best cars.

It is an interesting commentary that Mario Andretti  has always been irked that his F1 championship was won in a car that was so much better than everything else that year.

#12 snafu

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Posted Sep 20 2020 - 03:09 PM

I have to say any set up which starts GH..... usually tries to kill me at every opportunity. :(

I do usually start with someone else's setup. I'm sort of ok with most parameters (Within the bounds of my ability) but bump and rebound are still a mystery to me, so I usually look at several setups and go for an average figure.

Then if I can get the (Hot) tyre pressures in the 24 Front, 26 Rear area and temperatures fairly equal across the tyre then that's what I go with. Gearing is a personal thing as are diff and clutch parameters. Years of British motorcycle ownership means I tend to "over gear" as I am uncomfortable with hitting the redline. ;) usually aiming for a maximum of around whatever the peak power is for a specific car and knocking off 500rpm which gives me a bit of headway in case I get a slipstream.

TTFN
John.




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